This Motorcycle News Site To Disappear?

I agree with everything stated, with the exception of the "minimizing ads". It looks to me as about 1/2 the page is ads.

The content is outstanding, so I just ignore the ads and enjoy what you provide. I do not use AdBlock. But I've never clicked on an advertisement either; on any site.

Just my opinion, but fewer ads, with better treatment might yield better results from users and for advertisers. As far as the magazine point is concerned... Ads in magazines are more attractive than any web ad, they usually don't share space with content, and sometimes provide good material for cutting out and putting on a bulletin board to dream of owning one day. It's not an apples-to-apples comparison.

Just my .02. I hope a solution is found because I am a daily reader. But the ads are just not inspiring or interesting. I don't think AdBlock is entirely the problem...

This Motorcycle News Site To Disappear?

Amen.

700% decrease over the last 3 months? Ouch! That can't be just Adblock. Adblock has been around for about as long as Firefox. Something else is going on. My site suffers from ad blocking programs too, but I still see a growth in income, namely from a growth in traffic.

You site sucks anyway

Your site sucks anyway.

Thanks for the comments Johnny. It's true there are a reasonable amount of ads, but it's less then you think. In fact, there are 7 ad blocks (the top block can have between 1 and 4 ads). The rest are logos (motorbiker.org is the parent site), MBI is the association of blogers, and there's one charity logo (Riders-which I don't consider a logo).

But is a catch 22 situation, if I had more income from the ads, I wouldn't need that many. Since I don't, I try to find more income source, hence more ads....

Damned if you do, damned if you don't...

Hi Steve,

It's in the last 4 months that Adblock has really taken off. Initially, I thought it was a hiccup, but after "talks" with other webmasters, it's becoming more apparent that the problem lies with Adblock.

This site has a reader growth of 10-20% per month, but income keeps going down..

Anon, thanks for dropping by!

This Motorcycle News Site To Disappear?

My site's traffic is steadily increasing by a similar rate, and my income is increasing as well, both on AdSense, and the few affiliate programs I'm running.

There is a naturally occuring trend where advertising performance weakens as traffic increases. The effective CPM of a CPC or CPA-based ad drops when traffic rises. This is because your audience is becoming more diverse. But the bottom line still increases with traffic.

You must have an incredibly high percentage of Firefox users. I show only 18% of my total readership is using some version of Firefox. Of that 18%, there's still a smaller percentage actively using Adblock.

I’m in the same boat...

My revenue has nosedived in the last few months, and I also think this is in part due to ad blocking solutions out there that are becoming more and more effective in picking out and blocking ads. Good luck in finding a solution...

Steve, I'm running close to 30% for Firefox users. Anyway, that's a conversation we should have back at MBI...

Anon, it just shows that there are a "few" sites that suffer from this. There have been many calls to Firefox to do something about it, but so far, they're not playing the game (conflict of their interets).

The easiest would be to have an identified in the Firefox id that states that Adblock is present. Then we would know for certain how many adblockers there are, and how much it's costing us. We can then decide to block Adblockers or not.

This Motorcycle News Site To Disappear?

Sorry mate, but adblock is there to stay. I can't imagine browsing with it turned off... Your site is overwhelming without it anyway, you have too much advertising, which I'm sure nobody is clicking on and is paying peanuts for impressions.

How much does this site cost you for a week? I can't be that high. Take that number and using your readership numbers find *one* exclusive advertiser. Put a banner and one story every week thanking him, with a URL. Remove all other advertising and logos.

And turn full rss feed on, with the weekly advert in it.

Simple. I'm sure you can find one online merchant interested in the numbers or readers you have.

And BTW, before you do that get a good designer to revamp your front page (come on, yellow on black?)

This Motorcycle News Site To Disappear?

Not worried. I don't need you as a 'professional' news source. there are plenty of hobbyists out there re-posting aggregating and commenting on reports from real news-gathering organizations.

Anon, Yellow on Black???? Looks like you're looking at a different site!!

So you'd prefer to read fake article just to thank a sponsor??

Rick, if you check the archives you'll find that often I have broken the news before any, internet or print, pro or amateur.

BTW, before you shout "amateur", I actually work for 3 very big motorcycle magazines (under a different name, so no sense checking).

The problem Rick, is that even if this site goes down, you may turn to others, but if nothing happens, they will disappear as well. Before you know it, the internet will be like it was 10 years ago.

This Motorcycle News Site To Disappear?

Interesting that your Firefox users are at 30%, and mine are at 18%.

I'm to assume your readership is primarily USA. My USA readership is at 64%. I know you're in France, and my France readership is at 1.5% Total Europe readership is 18%, with most of that coming from UK.

I'm curious if your Firefox demographics has to do with the geographics of your readership.

Also, you seem to be aimed at all motorcycle riders, while my site is aimed at the cruiser and Harley rider. That's an interesting statistic on browser usage, Harley versus non-Harley.

This Motorcycle News Site To Disappear?

Why do you need to serve pop-ups?

I have no objection to ads that are actually on the page or imbedded in the text. I growl when a pop-up covers my screen. Advertisers need to understand the angst they cause by wanting popups instead of tasteful ads on the page you are viewing.

This Motorcycle News Site To Disappear?

Adblock and the others block more than just popups. They block the javascripts that serve up AdSense, etc. altogether.

Free sites like this, and just about every other biker site out there rely on ad revenue to stay alive. Losing that ad revenue means, eventually, that you'll lose that site. Period.

We need to stop killing the sites we love...

This Motorcycle News Site To Disappear?

700% of what? You're 700% means nothing. I assume you mean the rate of loss has increased 700%, but we don't have a base # to go by.

I certainly don't expect to know your hard #'s, but it's hard to be sympathetic when such a nebulous claim that really doesn't mean anything. I mean, we could be talking about $7, or $700.

Further, if I'm blocking ads (which I am, I admit), I'm not someone who was going to click on your ads in the first place. So you're not really losing anything to me other than your bandwidth. And I don't consider that stealing, since you yourself believe the internet should be "free".

Lastly, I also run a site powered by ads. Make over $70,000 a month on it. 25% are FF users, my revenue hasn't decreased (I just checked). But also provide a "premium" account to those who'd just like to contribute (they don't get ads by default when logged in).

I'd pay to be premium if I felt it was justified. I already pay for accounts on four sites. I think you underestimate that revenue stream. I hope you reconsider.

no more news ?

hi, mike i will be very sorry to see the site go, i visit it every day .i must remember to click on the ads on the site every time i visit from now on . and i must say that i do not find the ads intrusive at all . maybe you could try a paypal link for donations for a while and see how that goes ? . when i look back at the vast amount of info i have picked up from your site over the years it,s incredible to think that it has all been completely free for everyone to use . maybe those of us who are regulars need to remember to click on the ads before we read what the latest news is . i do hope this is not the last we hear from you .

This Motorcycle News Site To Disappear?

I with Paul Mitchell on this one. I hope this isn't the end for this site. I too visit everyday at work. I can't believe how many whiny people are on here complaining about the ads. I will make sure to click on a few for ya!

This Motorcycle News Site To Disappear?

i don't think you should be so quick to blame adblockers or the people using adblockers... why are people using adblockers?? the ads started becoming so obnoxious and intrusive. so much so that someone came up with a solution. obviously there was a demand for the product. unfortunately your site may be collateral damage in the ad v. adblocker wars... maybe if people value the content in your site, they;ll find a way to help support it, either through donations or clicking on the ads.

This Motorcycle News Site To Disappear?

Well I guess you're going to have to come up with a different business model, Adblocking is the way of the future.. if only you didn't force them down our throats it wouldn't have come to this.

By the way.. love the site, and i'll disable AdBlock on your site only and may click on an add every now and then.

How about hosting your own files, i can't browse your site from work because of the stupid photobucket.

Steve, it may be because I had been very active in promoting Firefox, so many of the readers that were convinced still visit this site.

Correct, about 70% of my readers are in the USA.

Patric

There are NO popup ads on this site! I hate them, and will not have them.

Agustin,

Your response baffles me. On one side you say you use Adblock, on the other you say you make 70,000 per month on advertising on your site. Talk about double standards!

As for 700%, who cares? a) I'm not allowed to mention earnings - that a hard Google rule, and b) I already stated that it's not enough to pay for cost.

Now, cost is high due to the platform I used. Hosting alone costs a minimum of $125 per month, plus bandwidth over 2 G, so I pay some 150-190 per month. That's just for the hosting.....

Paul & Max

Thanks guys. This is not a call for people to click! It's a call to remove Adblocker (at least for this site).

Sites get paid for showing ads, no matter if you click or not. The amounts are very low to display an ad, much higher when you click, so not clicking is fine, as long as the ads get displayed.

DubSix

With Adblock, you can actually tell it to show ads for a specific site, so if you have a preferred site, tell it to show ads here.

This Motorcycle News Site To Disappear?

Mike, first of all -- great site. Thanks for some great content!

I don't use an Adblocker and am complete against their use, but perhaps if you targeted your ads a bit more. I know it's gone now, but the 'Fart Button - Press Me' ad you had up for ages was pretty bad... I see that it's now been replacing with an "I bearly love you" ad, but I'm not sure how many bikers are going to click through that (although I may be mistaken here, ha ha!)

Thanks AndrewN

I have little control over those ads, they are generated by the ad provider. The ads change depending on geographical location, so you see the fart button in the UK, but someone in the US may see something totally different.

I'm looking at some other providers that may have more interesting ads. I know the Google ads are quite good and context sensitive, but you can only put up 3 blocks.

I'm trying to get sponsors to take the place of those annoying ads...

Ads.

There are other ad blockers used by other browsers.

You don't need an ad blocker to block ads: some people use a hosts file.

Get a few sponsers, include bog-standard links to their sites in an understated, friendly way at the bottom of each news entry ("this news post made possible due to the kind sponsorship of *company name and link*"), and you'll bypass ad blockers and hosts files (and, if you've picked carefully enough, get more clicks; I know I've sometimes clicked on Google mail ads due to the sheer relevance of some of them).

Yes, I agree, having a "sponsorship" on the site is much better, but, that's another pet peeve of mine...

I'm not a local site, ie, my news is meant for the world, hence the fact that the site is in English; So the readers are all over the world.

However, most companies still operate the old way; their head office delegates PR to the regional representatives. In my case, that would be France. So, let's say I contact BMW in Germany. They will say, since I'm in France, I will need to contact their French counterparts. When I do, they'll ask me the logical questions "how many readers do you have in France". Since only 6% are France based, they're not interested, no matter how high the readership is.

Same applies to contacting USA based companies. I have one ad from the US at this moment, and have a few in the past, but never from big manufacturers.

This Motorcycle News Site To Disappear?

i think you're going to lose more users and narrow your revenue stream by blocking firefox useres - as you have done... unfortunately for you, there are plenty of other motorcycle news sites around the internet... it's doubtful users are going to switch browsers just to view your site...

This Motorcycle News Site To Disappear?

anarchy, I did block Firefox users, just Adblock users. I sue FF myself, it's Adblock that's blocked!

This Motorcycle News Site To Disappear?

"anarchy, I did block Firefox users, just Adblock users. I sue FF myself, it's Adblock that's blocked!"

i think what you're trying to say is that you *didn't* block firefox users... and that you don't sue ff, but *use* firefox...

that's too bad... basically you're forcing your readers to view your ads. ironic, as i believe you said you thought the internet should be "free." now you're forcing visitors to pay the price of viewing ads (more specifically, not using adblocker) to see your content...

This Motorcycle News Site To Disappear?

Come on, Mike has a valid point here. Why use Adblock? If you don't want to, don't click on an ads, simple. We do buy bike magazines with a lot of advertising - the print medium doesn't give us a choice there. So why cheat people like Mike who make a few bucks running a website for motorcycle enthusiasts like us? Come on, have a heart, don't use things like Adblock etc.!

This Motorcycle News Site To Disappear?

Thanks Sameer, but I'm afraid there's a group of people who think they are in their rights to cheat me out of money. They think whatever is on the net is theirs and should be ad free, and subscription free. The fact that there are loads of cost involved escapes them.

That's why I feel I'm in my right to block, where possible, people who use this evil adblock. It's like fighting spammers, who also feel it's in their right to mass mail stuff people don't want. The fall in the same category.

Double Standards?

Stealing? People who use adblock use it because of the abuse of advertisers we suffered for many years (popups, popunders, popovers, etc). Did you JUST get on the internet or something?

BTW it would be double-standards if I did what you're doing. But I don't. Since I have other methods of showing appreciation, it's fine with me if they block ads. Further, people who block ads aren't the ones who click on them to generate revenue. It's ridiculous to think otherwise.

This Motorcycle News Site To Disappear?

Agustin, I wouldn't know what other word to use, since I pay for the hosting and bandwidth used when someone with adblock comes to my site.

And remember, it's not just the clicks on the ads that generate the money to pay, in fact, few people do. It's the displaying of the ad that pays the costs. So just showing the ad pays the bills, but if the ad is blocked, I don't get paid, but I do need to pay the costs.

So you tell me what I should call it...

This Motorcycle News Site To Disappear?

I've disabled Ad-Block Plus for this site but I am still getting:

"This page cannot be displayed because ad blocking software has been detected."

Shouldn't I be able to see you site, ads included?

I'm using Internet Explorer to post this comment.

This Motorcycle News Site To Disappear?

Mike,

I understand all too well where you are coming from. I too run a bit of advertisement on F800Riders.org, and I actually run some ad filtering software as well.

Why do I run it? For me, personally, I run the software because there are sites that are just overwhelming in regards to advertisements they display. It overshadows the content, makes the page confusing, and overall it's a bit tacky.

When I eliminated the underperforming advertisement block on my website, and moved to a better, more targeted ad provider that could automate advertiser signup, and integrate with Google, my click through amount and percentage improved.

Additionally, your hosting fees seem to be rather outrageous. You might want toward different hosting or a different platform.

If you want to talk, feel free to email me.

Rob

This Motorcycle News Site To Disappear?

Mookie,

Yes, I'm afraid at this moment it's all I could do, knowing that there would be a few innocent casualties (those that have ABP disabled or my site on a whitelist). I'm working on another script that will hopefully solve this issue.

In the mean time, if you want to see this site on Firefox with ABP, use the IE Tab extension. Sorry for your problems seeing this site.

This Motorcycle News Site To Disappear?

Hi Rob,

yeah, I'm working on new ads (just replaced on of the Valueclick ads which featured above the fold for a Google one, not because it was underperforming but because they were a) too graphical, b) not enough of them and c) nothing to do with motorcycles or computers or internet).

The vertical ad from Valueclick might shortly be replace by something much better that may hopefully see the day of light next year, which hopefully will be interesting for all readers.

As for my hosting costs, that's because I use IBM/Lotus Domino, and there are very few hosters available, driving the price up. In fact, I use the lowest price hoster out there....and I'm staying with Domino, because it offers me far more possibilities than any other platform.